Conversation with UN Assistant Secretary General Matthias Schmale

In Episode  12 of The Fading Causes Podcast: I talk frankly with Matthias Schmale, United Nations Resident and Humanitarian Coordinator for  Ukraine  asking him if Mr Putin has the GPS coordinates of his bedroom? Or will Matthias just be collateral damage if something bad happens – like to the thousands of civilians who have succumbed to drones and missiles?

Meanwhile, what does his bureaucratically-splendid title mean to the average person when they hear sirens and rush to bunkers? Matthias says that he is paid to stay optimistic. I guess that he deserves every dollar he earns – not because of working day-in-day-out in a conflict zone but because of the obvious challenges of leading the vast UN system and herding – aka coordinating – the wider international community.

His role is undoubtedly a labour of love for him at a time when there is little love lost for the UN as an institution. His sincerity to stay true to the faith is genuine. How he does that becomes clearer when we peek into his diary and hear of endless hours on the road getting across the vast country including the embattled Eastern front. To be seen where it matters is part of the job even if what you can do is limited.

But Matthias is no besotten lover (of the UN) and our chat turns to its contradictions amidst talk of reforms around its 80th anniversary. And he makes me wonder if it is not the countries that are brazenly and shamelessly flouting UN norms and conventions – but that the sheer volume, scope, and un-implementability of them is leaving nations farther and farther behind? No wonder the question of UN relevance and trust keeps coming up.

Matthias also served in UNRWA as Gaza director before the territory was turned into rubble, and later he was UNRWA director in Lebanon where I went to see his work. We also worked together at the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies – IFRC where we often disagreed but, together, we learnt a lot. Such as the limits to humanitarian principles in an unprincipled world.

We turn to dilemmas with no definitive answers – if there were, they would not be dilemmas! Such as when it is right for humanitarians to speak up and inevitably offend authorities, thereby losing access to suffering civilians?

And so we compare our experiences: mine, as UN Coordinator in Sudan – twenty or so years before his equivalent role in Ukraine. Both concerned with heading very large wartime aid operations in huge countries How has the UN system changed – for better or worse- between my time and his?

We hint at legacies: mine is for scrambling but failing to stop the first genocide of the Millennium in Darfur, the repeat chapter of which unfolds with equal failure now. Perhaps history will be kinder to Matthias ? Or are all high level careers doomed to end in tears? What does he want inscribed on his tombstone?

Watch/listen to this very human conversation in an inhumane world.